Why are US doctors allowing genital mutilation?

the same men would never accept ritualistic cruelty done to themselves or their sons.

I think they do, here in the US, and it's called circumcision.

It might not, as jedipunk pointed out, be the exact equivalent of FGM, but I think the concept of accepting "harmless nicking" is. I also agree with you, Loretta, that the "harmless" part sort of defeats the original purpose of FGM and won't be accepted as an alternative.

Don't forget the Prince Albert pierce, although you have to pay extra for that.

But people do pierce their clits.

But people do pierce their clits.

Yes, people do. Adult people, who make an informed choice (or poor drunken decision LOL) to do so. The AAP is recommending allowing this on tiny newborns bases on tribal beliefs. Wouldn't you like to have a say in whether your body was "nicked" or pierced?

I'm not advocating it. I don't know why people want to pierce their genitals, but they do say it's harmless (?).

FGM is based on misogynist traditions that harm women in many ways. Do we really want to placate misogyny in any form?

What else should doctors be doing to girls that is not medically necessary? Some people believe that masturbation is a sin. Since that is their tradition, should the doctor be performing procedures on girls that prevent them from masturabating? Some people believe that girls must do all they can to make themselves "attractive" to the opposite sex. Should doctors be appeasing them by inflicting plastic surgery on the noses, breasts and body parts of their children?

There is no medical need to "nick" female genitals, therefore no doctor should be doing it

There is no medical need to "nick" female genitals, therefore no doctor should be doing it

exactly!!

I'm not advocating it.

Then what are you doing?

I'm trying to keep an open mind.I'm accepting the fact that people do things for cultural reasons that I don't understand and wouldn't do myself. I find the idea of mutilating someone in such a way that causes extreme harm horrible and disgusting. But I can accept that there are customs that involve strange things and if they aren't harmful, then they are none of my business.

From what I understand, this procedure is very differnt than the FGM that they do to these girls now and is more like what they do now to males or what people do to themselves (for whatever reason they do genital piercing) and would not ruin their sexual response .So, I guess I am thinking that if this is a compromise that would save these poor girls from enduring such a gruesome fate then it may be worth looking into or even allowing the doctors that are proposing it to give it a try. I personally don't have much experience with genital piercing so I don't know what if any problems are associated with it. I have been told by friends that have such things that they don't cause any health problems or sexual issues. I'm not sure how I feel about this compromise, but it seems like they are genuinely trying to find a way to help.

I can't keep an open mind about allowing doctors to pierce a newborns genitals for the sake of culture.

I'm accepting the fact that people do things for cultural reasons that I don't understand and wouldn't do myself. I find the idea of mutilating someone in such a way that causes extreme harm horrible and disgusting. But I can accept that there are customs that involve strange things and if they aren't harmful, then they are none of my business.

So you support and condone butchering little girls? Educated people, who have common sense, know that culture is no excuse when it comes to matters like FGM.

Here's a video for you to watch Sunny,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mspMEMD8OeE&feature=related

The thing is...it's not our culture. Why would we even consider allowing mutilation of female genitalia here? There is 0 medical or hygenic reason for it. And if you check into the history of and reasons for FGM, why in the world would we want to be tolerant of it??

The thing is...it's not our culture.

So that makes it okay to cut little girls genitals off? Did you even watch the video?

And if you check into the history of and reasons for FGM, why in the world would we want to be tolerant of it??

Why in the world would you use culture as an excuse to condone female genital mutilation?

Auteur...that was my point lol. The overly PC folks want to condone it as a cultural thing...well it's not our culture and why should we lower our standards to allow mutilation of babies because it is accepted in another country? Should we also allow child slavery? Just because another country hasn't progressed beyond that doesn't mean we should regress.

Should we also allow child slavery?

Isn't that one reason that female genital mutilation is done, to make young girls slaves to men?

Exactly. So why would we even consider accepting this practice in our country? Imo the very idea of allowing this goes way beyond PC.

Why should we allow it to continue in other countries?

We aren't the world's police force? The sovereignty of other nations?

We aren't the world's police force? The sovereignty of other nations?

Agreed. We can set an example (in a perfect world lol) and encourage other nations to follow suit but we can not really impose our beliefs and laws on all other countries. Could you imagine what would happen if the same happened in reverse...picture a strict Muslim culture imposing their morality and standards on us.

Amnesty International? World Health Organization? United Nations? They probably all have something to say on the subject of, oh, human rights violations.

Yup and it's their job to police countries on violations of agreed basic human rights. That way we don't have countries barging in on each other constantly trying to force each other to conform to their own cultures. Well...in a perfect world anyhow.

picture a strict Muslim culture imposing their morality and standards on us.

Already happening, more like they're trying to.

Already happening, more like they're trying to.

It's not okay for them to do it just as it is not okay for us to do it. Imo they're just taking advantage of the foolish degree to which we've taken the PC movement. That's our own fault.

"Our fault" for what exactly?

Our fault for "the foolish degree to which we've taken the PC movement".

Only those who endorse it.

Lol point scored Auteur :) You are absolutely correct on that! I was referring to "we" as in our society but you're right - not everyone endorses it.

I agree with those who say that circumcision is MGM. However, there are those who claim it is medically necessary for various reasons. There is no similar claim of medical need to "nick" female genitals.

Some idiot actually used breast augmentation as a comparison to male circumcision when it was stated that male circumcision was not a major medical necessity.

There's always some idiot who whines about male circumcision on a thread about female genital mutilation as though male circumcision is the most horrendous thing on earth, then they try to disprove facts presented to them about the differences between male circumcision and female genital mutilation, along with the fact that unlike "circumcised" females, circumcised males can still lead normal healthy lives and have normal healthy sex lives.

Very true. There is no comparison. A true comparison would be what the Christian Coptic priests made a living doing: taking young boys and, in one slice with a knife, removing their penis, testicles and scrotum, then selling them as eunuch slaves if they lived. 75% of them didn't.

Of course, that hasn't been done for hundreds of years, and no one would say that we should appease them with a lesser mutilation if it was still happening.

Dr. Kellogg, who believed in pouring carbolic acid onto the genitals of little girls as punishment for touching themselves, also believed in circumcising little boys without anaesthesia for the same reason. That is how circumcision came to be a part of our culture: to stop masturbation. Today, there are all sorts of arguments as to why it should be continued even though there is no clear cut medical necessity and never was.

From my point of view, the genitals of both sexes need to be left alone. Nature did not make a mistake, so why should we pretend they need to be altered for any reason?

But no one should ever compare circumcision of little boys to FGM. The two simply have no comparison.

Dr. Kellogg, who believed in pouring carbolic acid onto the genitals of little girls as punishment for touching themselves

He should pour the acid on his own genitals.

There's a medical reason for male circumcision but it's not a major medical necessity though, as it can be avoided with proper and diligent hygene. Some studies have also reported that uncircumcised males tend to be at risk for UTI's and HPV, and that they could transfer the HPV to their sexual partners.

He should pour the acid on his own genitals

And in his eyes, too, while he is at it. I've never heard of something so absolutely sick. That the the American Pediatric Association even remotely thinks of this as a possibility is an an absolute outrage!

I have always wondered about a couple of the pediatricians that I had as a girl, and now I know-- they were sickos.

ARRRGH!

Someone please give me an intelligent explanation of why we should allow mutilation of young girls to appease immigrants?

Because the immigrants still perform female genital mutilation. They either send their daughters to a relative's house, call a midwife in, or send their daughters to their native country to have the procedure be performed.

Some have even asked trained medical professionals to perform the procedure, though even with a trained medical professional girls will still face the same horrendous complications that the thousands of other girls face when the procedure is performed by a non-trained medical professional.

Instead of appeasing them, we need to send them to prison.

There's a 5 year prison sentence for people who perform FGM in some parts of Africa but the law is poorly enforced as offenders often repeat their offenses time after time as soon as they get out.

I'm with Loretta. If they do it in our country - prosecute. This isn't something we should lower our standards on to match the standards where they are from. After all, if where they were from was so great, why are they here?

After all, if where they were from was so great, why are they here?

To avoid persecution, why else? America's stupid "freedom of expression" and "freedom of speech" crap basically protects sickos like these people.

Does freedom of expression and speech really cover mutilation of babies? Wasn't there an article last week about someone being arrested for tattooing babies?

Does freedom of expression and speech really cover mutilation of babies?

The immigrants will claim that it does.

Wasn't there an article last week about someone being arrested for tattooing babies?

Citation?

The immigrants will claim that it does.

The very fact that they expect us to lower our standards to accomodate their culture to that degree imo is testimony to the fact that we have taken "PC" a bit too far.

Citation?

It was on the vine. I'll look for it tomorrow since I'm on my way out. I'm pretty sure Maddad posted it.

Lol....pretty bad when you have to try to create a debate with someone you completely agree with. I don't expect we'll see anyone pop up actually advocating this stuff though.

I hope no one would advocate it, not even in the minimal form. It is time for women to be completely freed from this cultural hocus pocus that is solely meant to degrade and devalue them.

As I stated earlier, I can't imagine anyone proposing to "just nick" men's genitals if women were demanding that all of their genitals be removed ala the Coptic priest's method.

So why give in the a cruel demand for any sort of female genital mutilation?

What if they said, "Okay, then nick the clitoris right off there. It's small."? That would still be a cruel manmade deformity that would severely affect her sex life.

They also have some sick torture procedures for children accused of witchcraft and other heinous crimes.