
Worst of all? Hearing Cheney try to jam Obama about the dangers of "walking away" from her father's mess — after Dick and W. did exactly that when they got the genius idea to launch their epic fail in Iraq.
These criminals have absolutely no shame.
Listening to a Cheney give advice about how to “win” in Afghanistan is rather like asking an arsonist what to do about your house as it burns to the ground.
This seed is inaccurate. "Walking away from Afghanistan" means what has been circulated in the Obama administration as pulling all combat troops. Cheney or Bush did no such thing. They may have reduced troop levels when fighting in Iraq, but they did not pull out all troops.
This is just another paranoid troll piece.
Wrong. Bush and Cheney never wanted to go to war in Afghanistan. They did so because to go to war with Iraq after 9/11, without at least paying lip service to Afghanistan, widely viewed as the "home base" of al-Qaeda, would have been catastrophically unpopular. But once we had gotten some headlines and destabilized the Taliban regime, Bush/Cheney turned their backs on Afghanistan and put all their time and effort into promoting the invasion of Iraq. This is fact, buddy, not "liberal spin."
Listening to a Cheney give advice about how to “win” in Afghanistan is rather like asking an arsonist what to do about your house as it burns to the ground.
Carloz I watched her this morning and was surprise no one said a word about the HATE she was spreading, she called the president a coward and a fool, she said in so many words that the president was making the country weak when her daddy and Bush was the ones who made the country weak, and she and her daddy is still trying to bring America, why? BECAUSE THEY ARE BIGOTS AND RACIST.
Really Max... Not "Liberal Spin"?
The facts are that after we invaded Iraq most of the terrorist went to Iraq. Now that the war is pretty much done there they have gone back to Afghanistan.
Don't get me wrong I think the war was mishandled in the first place. We should have thrown every single troop we had into Afghanistan and hunted down all those piece of @!$%#s but we didn't. The fact is if we leave then the terrorist win and they get their old turf back and we are right where we were before 3k plus people were slaughtered.
Things don't look too good for Obama. Our troops are tired and been worn raw. We still don't have enough troops in Afghanistan to win the war against the Taliban. We have a dumb ass Iran being stupid and an even dumber North Korea being just as stupid.
The only thing Obama has going for him is that he has a Leftist group who won't attack him no matter what he does and has the Right who believes in this war. Bush had the Left who attacked him for everything so Obama has a lot going for him on this one.
The fact is if we leave then the terrorist win...
Among the many "messes" left by the Bush Administration is the lack of clear objectives for the wars into which they took our country.
Just a reminder... We invaded Iraq because of WMD. We later found out what the whole rest of the world had always known: There were no WMD. Four years after recognizing that there had never been any WMD... we're still there...
As for Afghanistan... We went in for two reasons: to destroy al Qaeda (including killing Bin Laden of course) and to blow away the Taliban for having given al Qaeda a safe haven. Within a few months, the Taliban were scattered to the winds, and it was clear that Bin Laden and al Qaeda had escaped to Pakistan. Eight years later... we're still there...
So...before we say who's winning these wars... let's define what we mean by "winning"!
If we go talk to those warlords whom we call the Taliban, and we say to them, "OK, here's the deal: You keep al Qaeda and all other international terrorists out, and you lighten up a bit on your women. In exchange, we'll let you have Kabul. You keep this deal, and we're all cool. You break the deal, and we'll come back and blow you out again. We know we can't hold the country... but you know we can blow you out any time we want. Do we have a deal?"
That is what we did in Iraq, and it worked.
In Afghanistan, too, that is how we can "win"!
jason
al-qaeda and the taliban are completely different. they never left afghanistan for that is where they live and control the opium and heroin trade. why would they sacrifice themselves to go fight in iraq? i think that you may have your facts confused.
The facts are that after we invaded Iraq most of the terrorist went to Iraq. Now that the war is pretty much done there they have gone back to Afghanistan.
We had no REAL reason to invade Iraq in the first place!!!!
Taliban supported Al Queda and Al Queda supported the Taliban. We are talking a minor difference in names. Iraq wasn't because of WMD it was for a ton of reasons but mostly because they had thumbed their nose at us a few to many times.
Not that it matters because we are there and we did win in Iraq. We can win in Afghanistan too but we need to know what winning is and have it spelled out.
We are talking a minor difference in names.
No. During the American Revolution, the Americans received critical assistance from France's absolute monarch, Louis XVI. That hardly means that Louis espoused revolutionary ideals nor that the Founding Fathers were closet royalists!
They had a common enemy.
So do al Qaeda and the Taliban: us.
So... we need to drive a wedge between them. Money can buy a really effective wedge...
no one has ever been able to win in afghanistan. we will see what happens, i guess. personally, i think that you have to give them an economy other than the opium trade. there are other crops that could be grown and money to be made in that manner. these people need to live and eat just as we do, so to think that we could eradicate the opium trade when it is the only source of income is crazy.
Iraq wasn't because of WMD it was for a ton of reasons but mostly because they had thumbed their nose at us a few to many times.
If that was the reason we invaded, then why did Bush and Co. feel the need to fabricate evidence of WMD's? Why not just say, "Hey, they thumbed their noses at us one to many times. That justifies a 7 year, trillion dollar conflict. Who's with us?"
But no. They lied. Then when they couldn't lie any more, they changed their story. Then they changed it again.
You can't say it doesn't matter because we are already there. Iraq will prove to be the biggest strategic @!$%# up of the next 100 years. God knows how long we will be dealing with that mess.
personally, i think that you have to give them an economy other than the opium trade.
I agree. That could very well be part of our deal with them.
If we were semi-intelligent, we'd be decriminalizing drugs in the US at the same time. If we ended prohibition, then the price of drugs would collapse... and Afghan peasants would be less apt to cultivate poppies. As long as there's a high price for drugs, they'll stick to a cash crop.
bob
the problem could be that we are supporting the cultivation of opium and the sale of heroin in our country. it does sound like something out of a conspiracy theory movie, but you never know.
800,
"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence." - Napoléon
some very rich people here are buying boatloads of heroin for distribution. i always find it odd that they can find one illegal immigrant clinging to the bottom of a truck at the canadian border, but they can not find boats, ships, and planes laden with heroin.
WE went into Iraq cause Bush the mental midget had to one up his daddy. He used the excuse that, "Saddam had tried to have his family killed" even when there has been NO REAL evidence other than some confessions given during torture. And by going into Iraq, many war based corporations have become obsenely rich. Bush Sr will leave his kids far more wealthy than before those wars,as will Dick.
Could someone please remind me of this woman's qualifications?
Why is anyone listening to her?
Liz Cheney is making all of the noises one would expect if she's considering going into politics herself. However the huge mistake she in making is aligning herself with one of the least popular and some (like me) would say most hated politicians in America, her father. As long as she remains his echo chamber and defender she'll never reach national prominence in politics. These days her last name doesn't carry much more respect then if it was Manson, McVeigh or Bundy. If she really wants to successfully run for office, then she needs to run as far away from her father as possible.
Liz Cheney is making all of the noises one would expect if she's considering going into politics herself.
Her full-time Bush-Cheney apologist act certainly is not helping her to make a name for herself. What original ideas, suggestions or propositions has she made?
None that I can see. All she seems to be saying is that she'd be just like daddy.
Welcome to Sarah Palin's VP Nominee Selection Game!
Liz Cheney is making all of the noises one would expect if she's considering going into politics herself.
Ding ding ding! We have a winner!
No way the bigot wing of the GOP would vote for a two-woman ticket, even if they ran Storm and Wonder Woman. But the idea of a Palin-Cheney presidency is truly horrifying.
R DONALD SNYDER, Ms or Mr liz is trying to show the people she or he is just as tough as her or his daddy.
No one, except for those weird Log Cabin Republicans, would ever support her. Many in the gay community see her as a turncoat.
No one, except for those weird Log Cabin Republicans, would ever support her. Many in the gay community see her as a turncoat.
Al 616 the white republicans have just as much disdain for woman as they do for people of color, they are all talking about Mrs Palin, they want her to keep up the good work showing her racism and bigotry so they don't have to fully expose themselves, when McCain picked her for his vice he thought he was going to get the Hillary vote.
Jerry, they will use anybody to parrot their ideology but manage to keep them at arms length. Corporate GOP has to prop up various personalities, hockey moms and other do-less mouthpieces on radio and Fox news to do their dirty deeds in criticizing the President and take the country back from the libs. Some of the front-runners they were grooming, C streeters Ensign and Sanford, were bad boys lately and they are still searching for that charismatic white guy they can use for a puppet.
Max,
I could see it now....Storm would be attacked for not being "American" enough what with her "strange" name: Oruro Munroe - and being an African Queen and all, they'd question her status as a natural born citizen - Dick Armey would be up in arms
As for Princess Diana, well, the Birther's would be demanding to see HER birth certificate at least as vociferously as they went after Obama. I mean, the Princess of the Amazons - a living Goddess clearly is not worthy to stand at Sarah's side.
These days her last name doesn't carry much more respect then if it was Manson, McVeigh or Bundy.
Which one? Ted or Al?
LOL! Ted. Al was a great man!
McGeorge??
I wonder will President Obama raise taxes to pay for this troop increase.This the first war that we've fought,that we did pay as we go.We can't keep borrowing money from China to spend in Afghanistan .Lets take this to Congress and get a vote on the troop increase and tax increase.I dont think very many Republicans would vote to send troops ,if they had to increase taxes to do it.
Brilliant idea.
Second that and applaud.
I like the way you think.
I wonder will President Obama raise taxes to pay for this troop increase.This the first war that we've fought,that we did pay as we go.We can't keep borrowing money from China to spend in Afghanistan .Lets take this to Congress and get a vote on the troop increase and tax increase.I dont think very many Republicans would vote to send troops ,if they had to increase taxes to do it.
apez54 The republicans will come out of their pockets, all you got to say is war and they become fired up and ready to go, it's strange they will go to war at the drop of the hat but don't want to help the poor, i suppose they think if they keep us poor they can use us as slaves, some one had a seed on the other night showing all the companies who have left the country with the blessing of our government, even the bail out money went overseas, the New york times said their are only 56.000 combat ready troops in the united states so where are we going to get those 40.000 from, the republicans don't want their children going because most of them have not been.
Brilliant, absolutely brilliant !
I can't say that I'm surprised by this, especially by Liz Cheney conviently omitting the detail about how the previous administration virually ignored Afganistan for years...
I can't say that I'm surprised by this, especially by Liz Cheney conviently omitting the detail about how the previous administration virually ignored Afganistan for years...
SuperSaiyan that is what republicans do, before it's over president Obama will be the one who started the wars, according to the republicans.
Liz Cheney-The newest nominee for the Darwinian Award.
...or Sarah Palin's VP selection, but I guess there's not much difference between the two, is there?
I'm surprised Liz has time for this. Isn't she supposed to be re-writing history for dear ol dad.
I'd like to get out. We did that when we helped the Mujahadeen kick out the Ruskies. Looked what happened then.
Those that keep repeating the same mistakes, hoping for a different result are just idiots, regardless of position or Party. The common denominator is "Govt Employee".
Hey Liz.. were we in Saigon I would insist "do khon nan".
LOL, put it in Google Translator if you want the English. Not suitable for Aunt Fanny or the grandkids.
I like the fact that Obama is thinking, ask the officials from the former Soviet Union. How do you unify100 different valleys that exist as 100 countries in one geographic nation and are you ignoring the problems with Pakistan, where the Taliban seems to reside? How about India? Iran, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan or China? How simple do you think this is? You don't just shove your middle finger up the butt of someone that you do not know.
I'd like to be freed from inferior Chinese goods. My computer mouse: Made in China. My stapler: Made in Taiwan. My GE clock radio: Made in China. My two hole punch: Made in China. My three hole punch: Made in Taiwan. My hardline business phone: Made in Mexico. My DELL monitor: Made in China. BUT:
My tape dispenser: Made in St Paul MN! I love my tape dispenser! HAHA!
I'd like to be freed from inferior Chinese goods.
No problem. As long as you're ready to pay anywhere from 20% to 500% more for the same items...
That is the real problem: America's (and Europe's, by the way) standard of living is based on cheap Chinese labor.
My computer mouse: Made in China. My stapler: Made in Taiwan. My GE clock radio: Made in China. My two hole punch: Made in China. My three hole punch: Made in Taiwan. My hardline business phone: Made in Mexico. My DELL monitor: Made in China. BUT:
My tape dispenser: Made in St Paul MN! I love my tape dispenser! HAHA!
And is your tape dispenser really that much better than your clock radio or monitor?
And what's wrong with Made in Taiwan? They have really good quality, like Japan.
Couldn't some of these products be "Made in the USA?" Why is my office imported from China, Taiwan and Mexico? Do they use American made hole punches? There is an investigation into Chinese drywall and we all know about the lead toys to name two. Why does America stand for? Whats it built on? Keep thinking...
They have really good quality...
... except when they don't, as in lead-based paint on children's toys...
Low labor costs are not the only reason for low prices. A total disrespect for standards is another reason!
bob
actually taiwan did not put lead in their toys, that was china.
True. My bad!
Go easy on Liz; she's our legitimate sister. Her father, Dick, conceived all of us alive and those yet to be born. But Liz seems to be as reckless as her father's first name.
Reality exists in the minds of a Republican. As their needs dictate, they will inform us of reality from time to time. We are to embrace that reality as if it was ours. When reality changes, even in the past, we will be informed so that we might comply. Graciousness is our duty: we do not want to ruin the trance or break the spell.
HEY LIZ! YOU'RE FULL OF CRAP! How's that for keeping the spell?
Worst of all? Hearing Cheney try to jam Obama about the dangers of “walking away” from her father’s mess — after Dick and W. did exactly that when they got the genius idea to launch their epic fail in Iraq.
These criminals have absolutely no shame.
Yep, just like daddy.
The Cheneys, Jesus! Why isn't the old man in jail yet? Oh well, the Devil will get his turn.
This seed is inaccurate. "Walking away from Afghanistan" means what has been circulated in the Obama administration as pulling all combat troops. Cheney or Bush did no such thing. They may have reduced troop levels when fighting in Iraq, but they did not pull out all troops.
This is just another paranoid troll piece.
ComSenWhen they went to Iraq to fight a war of choice what would you call that, if Bush and Cheney had done their jobs we would not be where we are now, WAR, LIE, UNNECESSARY
Considering that the Cheneys have been wrong about everything, I guess this means that we need to get out of Afghanistan NOW.
Hey, you're right!
If we want an infallible tool for making the right foreign policy decisions... we should always listen to Dick Cheney... and then... do the opposite.
The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reported that 500 farm-raised pheasants were released yesterday morning at the Rolling Rock Club in Ligonier Township for the benefit of Cheney's 10-person hunting party. The group killed at least 417 of the birds. Vice President Dick Cheney reportedly shot more than 70 stocked pheasants and an unknown number of mallard ducks at an exclusive private club. The birds are pen-reared and released to be shot in large numbers by patrons.
Sounds right...
:-(((((((((((
500 birds that were probably clipped so they couldn't fly. A canned hunt? Wow, how sporting. Kinda reminds me of millionaire Harley owners that dress up like bikers on the weekend.
Did he bag any lawyers this time?
I guess his hunting companions wore their bullet proof long johns and face guards since no "incidents" were reported.
Big, bad pen-reared pheasant hunter VP Cheney probably saw the wars as an opportunity to play big, bad armchair general, kind of like playing RISK but with real soldiers. JMO
Coach, spot on analogy.
Foreign policy whiz Liz should ask her father the same question. She could also ask Reagan and George Bush Sr supporters why they abandoned Afganistan after the Soviets left and the Mujahadeen now Taliban moved in. Conservative foreign policy under Reagan, Bush and Junior has been a disaster and not only in Afganistan. Iraq anyone?
... why they abandoned Afganistan after the Soviets left...
At about this point, we would hear a great deal of hemming and hawing... ... since we (through the good services of our favorite spook outfit over there in Langley) are the people who pumped up the Mujahideen / Taliban in the first place... ...
Iraq anyone?
ummmmm......... errrrr........ About how that guy Saddam got started? Well... those same spooks over in Langley.....
Lemme see... who was once the high-poobah spook?
The old "we were for them before we were against them" syndrome.
I don't know why legitimate Sunday morning political talk shows would even have someone like Ms. Cheney on as a panelist. I mean, what in the world makes her an expert on anything! It's not just the Cheneys of the world who are the problem, it's the 'left wing' media that gives them air time that are just as bad.
George Stephanopoulos showed his true colors back in April of 2008 when he used Sean Hannity questions for then candidate Obama. I sent the following e-mail to Mr. Stephanopoulos at "This Week with George Stephanopoulos" after the show yesterday:
Rumor is that ABC wants you to move to GMA. I hope you take the position.
When you allow Coburn and Blackburn to lie and over-talk the Democrats’ response, you fail as a moderator. When you include someone with no Bona fides as an expert on issues to sit on a panel because she is the daughter of a former VP, you fail as a commentator. When you allow a panelist to repeatedly misinform without challenging her, you fail as a journalist.
Baking Christmas cookies on GMA suits you better.
I would have said more but I was limited to 500 characters. . .
I don't know why legitimate Sunday morning political talk shows would even have someone like Ms. Cheney on as a panelist. I mean, what in the world makes her an expert on anything! It's not just the Cheneys of the world who are the problem, it's the 'left wing' media that gives them air time that are just as bad.
My sentiments, exactly, Ron!
Ron,
Did George send you a Christmas present?
I'll try his cookie recipe when I visit the grandkids over the Holidays. . . .
Once again the first family of Neo-Con lies and nonsense rears it's ugly head. I guess one can't fault Lying Lizzy for taking up for her war criminal daddy but - reality check!
The Dick, Cheney himself has openly admitted that the Bush administration ignored the War in Afghanistan and they never even had a "strategy review" until 2008. The Dick, Cheney would be the first to admit that we never had a chance of winning in Afghanistan because the Neo-Con strategy called for "fighting them on their turf so we don't have to fight them over here"....except the "turf" in Afghanistan wasn't quite suitable for these warfreaks because Afghanistan ain't got no oil...wallah, The War in Iraq!
Remember all that crap from The Dick Cheney about how we will fund the Iraqi War with Iraqi oil revenues? Riiight! KBR & Haliburton - close friends of The Dick Cheney are being funded by those revenues! The US taxpayer is still footing the bill - at around $30 billion a month~!
The War in Iraq was nothing more than "nation building"....and if you don't believe it go back and listen to The Dick Cheney during the first Bush campaign - it was clear even then that Neo-Cons wanted to "finish the job in Iraq"....
Liz Cheney like so many of these war lovers just don't want to face the reality that they have killed nearly 5,000 American soldiers (and by extension their families) for no good reason and we are mired in what is now the longest war in US history because they failed to do their duty...which would have been to go in with "overwhelming force" from the very beginning..
Someone should tell Lying Lizzy to do America a solid and STFU!
Just in- Cheney has once again changed the objective. It wasn't WMD's (Weapons Of Mass Destruction) they were searching for but WAD"s (Weapons of Ass Destruction). They found them! Corporate America had them all along and they were using it on us. We (Americans) were bent over and were raped economically. We wasted our blood and treasure to support failed policies here and abroad. Ms. Cheney your ranting and advice compares to the Rapist blaming the Victim for not providing the condom.
Cheney & Bush got out of their because there was no money there to be made... Iraq was a more profitable war for them...
The reason why Bush administration failed so miserably is that he was taking advices from his Dick as VP.
Dick Cheney and George Bush instead of going into Afghanistan and actually fighting and winning the war have engaged us in another prolonged police action that will take years to resolve and billions if not trillions of dollars to end. We would be better served to pull out save the lives of our troops and the billions of dollars and hope that we never have to return.
We haven't won one war the politicos have gotten us into since World War 11. Our leaders in Washington haven't learned to leave fighting the wars to the people we pay to do so and keep their noses out of it. There will be plenty of time to claim a hand in winning when it is over. Patton, Marshall, Bradley, and others must be rolling over in their graves at this mess the politicians have created and tried to control.
If we aren't going to listen to our generals, then we might as well as lay off the military and send the loud-mouthed politicians over to fight the war. Fat chance of that, the first shot fired and they would be out of the country.
Bring the boys home and save the money. By the way, bring the tanks, planes, jeeps and all other equipment home to. Also, fire all security companies, put the marines back in charge of the embassies and eat a little crow. Whatever fat head decided it was cheaper to hire these firms instead of using the marines, who we were already paying to perform the job, was a real meat head.
Why doesn't somebody tell the Cheney's to keep their noses out of our countries business. They screwed things up, left things in one hell of a mess, made sure the millionaires made their money legally and illegally, and then ran. I can't wish them enough bad luck.
I am not endorsing Obama, because he and his batch of tax dodging idiots are finishing the job of destroying this country. The American people are either a bunch of fools or just plain stupid.
We need some moral, ethical, and honest citizens to step forward and run for office. We already have to many jackasses in Congress filling their pockets at our expense.
And we care because....???????
Why?
This article has no credibilty. Just by it's language it lacks credibility but it is also not based in fact. 1) We went to Afghanistan after we went into Iraq because we saw increased activity by AQ and AQ related groups in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Afghanistan was not as high a priority as Iraq at that time and did not become as important until later. 2) We never "walked away" from Iraq. We have had changing levels of engagement but have never left. 3) Even if it were true that we "walked away" Dick Cheney was not the Commander in Chief and it would not ultimately have been his decision to "walk away". 4) Even if it were true that we "walked away" from Afghanistan, is there some law that a wife cannot disagree with her husband? 5) Is the situation in Afghanistan static? And would not changing circumstances lead to changing strategies?
This is a really weak attempt to create a story where there isn't one.
1) We went to Afghanistan after we went into Iraq because we saw increased activity by AQ and AQ related groups in Afghanistan and Pakistan.
No.
We went into Afghanistan before we went into Iraq.
4) Even if it were true that we "walked away" from Afghanistan, is there some law that a wife cannot disagree with her husband?
??? they're married ? you lack credibility buddy.
My bad - his daughter. Same principle applies.
O Lord, helps us, another Palin is on the rise.
Eloi, Eloi! why hath thou forsaken us?
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